Falls Creek to Mt Hotham Alpine Crossing

[bigkev]

The map-elevation graphic is insane.

Yes, I noticed that too It all looks pretty easy on that graphic!

[Baeng72]

1 FHAC is not a world-class walking experience. It's a nice walk and I've done all of it many times summer and winter for 50 years.

People have a bucket list: Torres del Paine, Mont Blanc circuit, Everest base camp, Kilimanjaro, and only then, if they're hardcore and have Olympic athletic abilities, do they think about Falls to Hotham Crossing.

[Xplora]

I received this as an email today but can't find a web link for it. The images and hyperlinks don't work in this forum but you can view it better here https://www.ski.com.au/xf/threads/falls ... st-4846342

It may help explain some things.

Date: 14 Sept 2021, 11:13
From: engage@parks.vic.gov.au
To:
Subject: Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing Spring Community Update

Welcome to the first edition of the Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing Community Update. In this initial edition we are providing an update on where the project is at, as well as answering some key questions around the project.

The Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing will be one of Australia’s outstanding alpine walking experiences that captures the essence of the Australian Alps – the solitude, the seasons, the breathtaking beauty and the stories of the High Country.

The Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing Master Plan outlines the proposed 57-kilometre, multi-day route, combining and upgrading an existing track network, which will take in the Diamantina Spur and Razorback with an optional ascent of Mount Feathertop, Victoria’s second-highest peak. The facilities created as part of the five-day, four-night route may also provide options for shorter overnight walks.

Since the finalisation of the Master Plan, Parks Victoria received money in 2018 to start doing the detailed planning and business case. In 2020 further funding was received to build the first stage of the walk. These are the two pieces of work we are providing an update for here.

Project update

In 2018 Parks Victoria was given $2 million to undertake detailed assessments and planning for the Falls to Alpine Crossing. Despite delays due to the current health situation a range of work has been done over the past 18 months including, a preliminary Environmental Values Assessment, better defining the scope of the project and mapping out the planning and legislative considerations required.

The piece of work we are currently focused on completing is the Environmental Values Assessment. We will share a summary of this report with the community when it is completed so you can better understand how the project will be designed to minimise impact on the environment.

We are also developing a Business Case and research into operating models, as well as undertaking the scoping stage of a Visual Landscape Assessment​.

These assessments will assist with refining:​

· The placement/location of camping and accommodation sites

· Accommodation details and design​

· Trail alignment, surface and grading

As a result, the final proposed trail, overnight sites and accommodation could differ from those shown in the original Master Plan to ensure all environmental and landscape aspects have been appropriately considered. This planning work is expected to be completed in early 2022.

In addition to the original $2 million announced in 2018, a further $15 million was allocated by the Victorian Government late last year for implementing Stage 1 of the project. Stage 1 includes doing track upgrades and creating up to two overnight campgrounds including roofed accommodation options.

The planning and assessment work from the first $2 million will guide what is delivered for Stage 1 of the project, including which parts of the proposed 57 -kilometre track will be upgraded. This stage of the project is expected to be completed by the end of 2023.

Completing the final parts of the crossing will be subject to future government investment.
Answering Key Questions

We have been hearing several key concerns during recent months. To ensure everyone shares the same understanding of the project we have answered these common questions. You can get in contact with us at FHAC@parks.vic.gov.au if you have further questions.

Why is the Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing being developed?

The existing walk between Falls Creek and Mount Hotham follows a 37-kilometre, three-day and two-night route as part of the 655-kilometre long Australian Alps Walking Track, which takes hikers through the alpine areas of Victoria, New South Wales and the Australian Capital Territory. The Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing Master Plan outlines an improved 57-kilometre, five-day and four-night route which will take in the Diamantina Spur and Razorback with an optional ascent of Mount Feathertop.

A crucial element to the success of the Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing is that different experience options should be available to walkers. These include a choice of tented or roofed accommodation, experiences both guided and independent, and having access to high quality information and interpretation.

This longer route is planned to support more walkers but avoid new facilities from being established within a designated ‘remote and natural area’ of the national park, which the current route passes through.

What are the benefits of the Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing?

The project will bring multiple benefits to the local communities and all of Victoria. It will:

- Create a walking icon that draws walking visitors from Victoria and beyond.

- Increase the accessibility of walking in the alps for more walkers by providing facilities such as roofed accommodation for people who may not be able to, or may not wish to, carry a full pack with tent, sleeping and cooking equipment.

- Enhance the walking trail network in the region by providing more walking and overnight options people can use for a variety of walks.

- Support local communities by drawing a range of visitors to the area in all seasons.

Will there be significant environmental impacts because of the project?

Protecting the environment is a guiding principle of all the work that will be done as part of this project. An independent Environmental Values Assessment is currently underway to ensure potential impacts are identified and that the appropriate avoidance and mitigation measures are put in place. The planning process is aimed at reducing current and future impacts on the values of the national park. Once this is complete the results will be shared with the community.

Will people be able to stay in luxury accommodation on the Crossing?

No. The accommodation planned for the Crossing is small huts only. They will provide protection from the elements to allow sleeping, cooking, toileting and appreciating the landscape. The Master Plan outlines the two overnight elements of the walk experience - camping or sleeping in a purpose-built hut. It is important to note that independent hikers can continue to self-select places to camp along the route for free (dispersed camping).

The specific designs of the huts are not yet decided. They will be small and designed to blend into the environments they are placed in, with the aim being that they will be as unobtrusive as possible.

Will helicopters regularly fly in to service the huts?

Any increase in helicopter flights will be minimal.

Helicopters already fly into Alpine campgrounds to service them on an infrequent basis.

Three of the four new proposed campgrounds on the Crossing will be accessible via management vehicles. The one proposed campground not accessible by road will need to be serviced by helicopter. This may require a small number of flights per year to remove wastewater and service any other elements of the overnight site.

Will people be able to fly into the overnight sites without walking to them?

No, flying into the overnight sites will not be possible. Bookings will only be accessible for people who walk to them.

Is the walking track going to be turned into a wide smooth ‘superhighway’?

This is not the case. The upgrades planned to the track are minor and are aimed at making the track clear and defined to improve safety and reduce off-track impacts. In some areas, upgrades will incorporate design features that manage drainage and erosion.

How are Aboriginal cultural heritage values being considered?

Traditional Owner groups have been involved in the development of the Master Plan and will be engaged throughout the next stages. The planning process will also seek to further understand the cultural landscape, which values need protection, and what aspects of culture may be shared with people undertaking the walk.



Want to know more? Come to an information session

We are committed to regularly updating the community as planning and work on the project progresses.

We will soon be running community information sessions to give people an update on where the project is currently at. During these sessions you will be able to learn more about progress on the project, next steps, and ask any questions you may have.

Online Information Session

Wednesday 27th October 2021

7pm-8.30pm

Register via the button below

We would like to thank those community members that have provided feedback to date, this has enabled us to take concerns into consideration, provide clarification and shape the project.



Register for Information Session



Stay up to Date

Parks Victoria will provide updates and information as the project progresses. To stay up to date please register your interest to receive community updates please click on the button below. You can also email us at fhac@parks.vic.gov.au.

To learn more about the Falls to Hotham Alpine Crossing visit www.parks.vic.gov.au/projects. As the project progresses this information will be updated regularly. You can also contact us on 13 1963.



Register for Email Updates

[Baeng72]

If the email is to be believed, it's a Vic version of the Overland private huts.

[Lophophaps]

What concerns me is that the above PV advice is false. Also, there's nothing to stop incremental development. Upgrade the tracks, more people visit, add toilets, add basic huts, more people, increase the size of the huts, more people, track under pressure so make the track better, more people so improve the huts, then privatise the huts. Beware of incremental developments - oppose them from the outset.

[Xplora]

Here is the web link for the information I posted earlier. You can register here for the seminar and email updates. https://www.parks.vic.gov.au/projects/f ... t-planning or here https://confirmsubscription.com/h/r/460 ... 23F30FEDED

[Xplora]

What concerns me is that the above PV advice is false. Also, there's nothing to stop incremental development. Upgrade the tracks, more people visit, add toilets, add basic huts, more people, increase the size of the huts, more people, track under pressure so make the track better, more people so improve the huts, then privatise the huts. Beware of incremental developments - oppose them from the outset.

The huts will not have a capacity to accommodate enough people to make the venture economic but if the government is paying for the huts then it doesn't matter. Governments throw money away regularly without any return. The huts will be privately run and PV is still pushing them as being able to be used for other than the walk. It will become less of a point to point walk and more of a place people can stay in luxury while getting a faux experience of being remote. Walk in from Pretty Valley to Tawonga huts takes about an hour. Privatising just means filling beds and the walk will become a distant second thought. It will be interesting to see what arrangement is made with commercial tour operators and the huts or accommodation providers at the huts. it will certainly be interesting if resort management tender for the accommodation.

[paidal_chalne_vala]

I still see Falls Creek / Mt. Hotham getting a lease on the proposed High Knob hut and helipad and operating BC heli - skiing on Mt. FT. Of course they will have qualified BC guides etc. to cover all backsides in this risk averse nanny state but even still such a venture , were it to occur would still meet with opposition and resistance from many people.

[Xplora]

I still see Falls Creek / Mt. Hotham getting a lease on the proposed High Knob hut and helipad and operating BC heli - skiing on Mt. FT. Of course they will have qualified BC guides etc. to cover all backsides in this risk averse nanny state but even still such a venture , were it to occur would still meet with opposition and resistance from many people.

I just don't see this happening. Heli skiing works in NZ but the conditions are much different. The mountain is different and allowing here would open up all parks to helicopter excursions. There is significant opposition to taking over High Knob and even some within Parks are against it. Stopping it will be a difficult thing. We will have to see what the environmental assessment comes up with.

[Xplora]

The business case has now been released and you can read it here if you like https://www.parks.vic.gov.au/projects/e ... ng-project (scroll down for the link)
Most of the important information has been redacted so there is no way to verify what is being put forward. From my initial reading it is clear the assumptions made in the desktop version put out years ago with the draft plan have been maintained and are grossly incorrect with respect to estimates of numbers. Tourism NE suggest many of the visitors to the High Country engage in some kind of walking activity but as I have mentioned before, all of the NE is considered High Country by TNE. If you see here https://www.victoriashighcountry.com.au ... source=whc you will note walks in Rutherglen on the Murray is High Country as is Benalla. The majority of walks promoted here are short and many in towns.

There is still an assumption of 10,000 people doing the FHAC each year currently and that figure is estimated to rise to almost 25,000 by 2050. This is what the business case is based on and there is an acknowledgement of some need for restrictions or permits if numbers get too high. There is also a note about winter use being low and Parks will have to investigate alternative usage for the huts during this time. Que the resorts to step in and run backcountry accommodation. A number of licenced tour operators expressed interest in using the huts during winter according to the report.

The estimates state by 2050 there will be 128 people start the walk every day in December and January. Considering day one is one of the longest legs (Falls Creek to Cope hut area along Heathy Spur) and people will not be walking in the dark you would assume most will start the walk in the morning. My guess would be 32 people starting every hour. Getting busy. It doesn't really matter as the numbers are simply not sustainable or realistic. There are just too many other influences that will affect when people will start a walk. If it is a paid tour you are restricted to the tour dates which is affected by availability of the guides and other bookings. Bad weather or bushfire will stop walkers.

The current walk has been described as lacking a hero factor and that is why it has been realigned to include Diamantina spur and Feathertop but the tour operators are not keen about taking clients up that way. The resorts are keen about having accommodation at High Knob and Tawonga huts and it seems these locations will be fast tracked.

The favourite model is one where the government pays for, builds and maintains everything and the private people just pay a fee for use. There is still no guarantee anything will happen and there will be some regulatory approvals required plus a lot more money than has already been allocated (a bit of a miss in the redactions left a vague mention of the amount being almost $15M for one option but that was not the preferred option. The preferred option costs more.)

I am pretty sure the entire business case would be thrown out (with lots of laughing) if it were a commercial venture and it is clear the resorts and TNE are the driving force. The way it will be setup releases the commercial interest from any obligation if it fails but Parks Vic will still have to maintain it from the already stretched budget for the district.

I can see a permit or entry fee being required to access some of the areas and not sure how it will affect day visitors. The idea was to make the area more accessible to a broader range of people but it is talking about restrictions if numbers get high and put strain on the environment.

[sandym]

My quick response is ACK. Why so many of these "great walks" that seem poorly disguised money making ventures? 57 km over 5 days is 11 km/day. On a good track that is under 3 hours, is this what the "normal" "average" walker does in a day?

[peregrinator]

My quick response is ACK. Why so many of these "great walks" that seem poorly disguised money making ventures? 57 km over 5 days is 11 km/day. On a good track that is under 3 hours, is this what the "normal" "average" walker does in a day?

If it's the madly grinning model walkers plastered all over the Parks Vic website, they might do 11 km in a week.

[CraigVIC]

There's plenty of this in the GPT proposal where the walk was to be specifically designed for people who are not regular walkers to do as a once off experience with LTO support. Whether they succeeded this sounds similar.

I find it quite extraordinary that Parks builds the huts out of precious grant money. Then maintains them, runs the enforcement and booking system but then they are monetized by private operators. And the (extremely expensive) track work is designed around the hut clients. And the huts are not available to clubs etc let alone independent walkers. And, in the case of the Grampians, they arrive hand in hand with an end to dispersed camping, huge new reference areas, heavy restrictions on off track walking.

You could mistake it for pure rent-seeking.

The Icon Walks have gone a long way down the tourism road since the GOW.

[Lophophaps]

In the last five years I've:
- seen log books at Cope, Dibbins and Derrick Huts.
- walked the track from the AAWT end of Heathy to Hotham.
- camped where I can see the number of people walking.
- camped at Cope and Derrick Huts.
- arrived at Dibbins early, people still packing up.

Rather than the spurious TNE or other model I rely on what I have seen. The numbers have always been and still are grossly inflated. The Overland Track has about 9000 people doing it each year. Saying that 10,000 people are doing the FHAC now is preposterous. I'd like to see evidence of this, perhaps the number of platforms booked.

For 10,000 people a year there will be around 7000 for October to April, seven months or 1000 a month or 30 a day. This means that 15-20 platforms are needed at a stated cost five years ago of $574,000. This figure is probably incorrect! If 128 people start every day, where will they camp?

I don't like the way that the justification for occupancy is now leading to commercial winter use. This is privatisation of the Alpine National Park by stealth, one little bit at a time, just as we said five years ago. The proposed infrastructure is closer to Three (should be Two) Capes in Tassie. What happened to remote values, nature and conservation?

The business case is laughable, poor return on investment, poor return on equity, standards compromised, and generally a very poor use of funds.

Depending on the amount of climbing, I can do 15-20 kilometres a day without too much hardship. Walking for just three hours a day is a waste of a walk. Or it's for people who are incredibly unfit and should not be there. Depending on the amount of daylight and the start time, this is how I would do the walk to take in all the features
1 Heathy, side-trip to Nelse, The Park, Langford East Aqueduct, Cope Hut.
2 AAWT to pole 333, side-trip to Jaithamathang, pole 267, Dibbins. Long day but mainly flat.
3 Derrick Hotham.
or vary the end
2 As above but down to Blairs.
3 Diamantina, lunch at and camp near Federation. After Diamantina I'm usually too decayed to go much further.
4 Bungalow.

What is ACK?

[Xplora]

Like I have always said, the plan is for the resorts to run winter accommodation in the park. It is noted in the business case that day 2 could skip Tawonga huts for some people. Tawonga huts is the ideal spot for Falls Creek to run backcountry tours and it has been planned that way from the very start. The hero factor for the walk is Diamantina spur and Feathertop but we all know most people will avoid this and walk out up Machinery Spur or via Dibbins and Swindlers. Hotham will take High Knob accommodation but that is more for the adventurous. People ski on the Razorback and Feathertop now and this will offer something extra. So you have BHP for some touring and some lines and the Razorback for the bigger thrill seeker.

Can you imagine what will happen in the morning when 128 people decide they want to go to the toilet? It will be like a que for a portaloo at a music festival and most people will trot off into the bush and not even bury it. I don't see the numbers ever happening but these are the numbers the business case relies on. The walk is the trojan horse. Get ready for permits and fees if you want to walk the High Plains. By making it accessible to a broader range Parks Vic will close it off to more people. Healthy Parks for Wealthy People.

[Baeng72]

What is ACK?

An expletive or expression of disgust I imagine.

[Baeng72]

Like I have always said, the plan is for the resorts to run winter accommodation in the park. It is noted in the business case that day 2 could skip Tawonga huts for some people. Tawonga huts is the ideal spot for Falls Creek to run backcountry tours and it has been planned that way from the very start. The hero factor for the walk is Diamantina spur and Feathertop but we all know most people will avoid this and walk out up Machinery Spur or via Dibbins and Swindlers. Hotham will take High Knob accommodation but that is more for the adventurous. People ski on the Razorback and Feathertop now and this will offer something extra. So you have BHP for some touring and some lines and the Razorback for the bigger thrill seeker.

Can you imagine what will happen in the morning when 128 people decide they want to go to the toilet? It will be like a que for a portaloo at a music festival and most people will trot off into the bush and not even bury it. I don't see the numbers ever happening but these are the numbers the business case relies on. The walk is the trojan horse. Get ready for permits and fees if you want to walk the High Plains. By making it accessible to a broader range Parks Vic will close it off to more people. Healthy Parks for Wealthy People.

I'm having a real hard time not going full misanthrope at the moment. The new, "better" fed. government is encouraging more fossil fuel extraction making any aspirational emissions target greenwashing, the US approved a "climate" bill that's actually a major ramp up of fossil fuel extraction. The local state government has all but outlawed protest of the obviously disastrous logging of remnant habitat. Parks are privatising the high country....ACK! indeed.

[paidal_chalne_vala]

We are doomed.The Planet has 50 years left maximum.
Just have fun in
the wild while you still can afford it , before it is sold off to the highest bidder.
They paved paradise and put up a parking lot .

In terms of user pays winter access to the BHP region I was out staying at the Rover Chalet for seven nights from 6-13/8/22.
We BC XC skied every day for seven or eight days.
Oh that was good !!!!
We ski toured a great swathe of the BHP mainly off the pole lines using the " as the crow flies" navigation approach in good weather conditions.
I met only two other groups of two people out using the BHP on skis during the entire week.
The log books were not full of entries from would be user pays glampers.
The log books had multiple entries from me all year round though!!
This whole scheme is not aimed at repeat visitors such as me who thrive on the area.
It is aimed at unfit cashed up bogans who will do this trip once and then go back to their junk food, telly and beer on the sofa in suburbia thinking that they have climbed K2 without O2.
Other than that the winter infrastructure access will be privatized by Falls and Hotham resorts for BC ski access accommodation for those who don't want to ski with a heavy snow camping pack on their back and camp in a snow tent.

[Lophophaps]

The FHAC business case has no public figures. Does anyone know if the Otways, Grampians and Croajingolong icon walks have available figures showing the number of walkers? Absent that, is there any anecdotal information about the number of users?

[sandym]

We are doomed.The Planet has 50 years left maximum.
Just have fun in
the wild while you still can afford it , before it is sold off to the highest bidder.
They paved paradise and put up a parking lot .

In terms of user pays winter access to the BHP region I was out staying at the Rover Chalet for seven nights from 6-13/8/22.
We BC XC skied every day for seven days.
Oh that was good !!!!
We ski toured a great swathe of the BHP mainly off the pole lines using the " as the crow flies" navigation approach in good weather conditions.
I met only two other groups of two people out using the BHP on skis during the entire week.
The log books were not full of entries from would be user pays glampers.
The log books had multiple entries from me all year round though!!
This whole scheme is not aimed at repeat visitors such as me who thrive on the area.
It is aimed at unfit cashed up bogans who will do this trip once and then go back to their junk food, telly and beer on the sofa in suburbia thinking that they have climbed K2 without O2.
Other than that the winter infrastructure access will be privatized by Falls and Hotham resorts for BC ski access accommodation for those who don't want to ski with heavy pack on their back and camp in a snow tent.

Sometimes I just want to give a four thumbs up to a post!

[Baeng72]

It does appear we're doomed, nobody who could stop *&%$#! happening will.
Democracy in reality is kleptocracy, owned by big business.
If I were boss of Woodside, I'd have one vote, and be on speed dial to Albo and he'd say "yes sir".
But I'm not, so I have one vote and my local member (labor) is voting against humanity's interests in parliament because fossil fuels mined in Oz, but burnt overseas are not our problem (apparently the atmosphere notes the Westphalian sovereignty and its borders).
So I'm going to adopt an element of Stoic philosophy: change what you can, and don't get worked up by what you can't.
Apologies for my political interludes/digressions.
Anyway, Trip report PCV or else.

[paidal_chalne_vala]

https://www.ski.com.au/xf/threads/bogon ... st-5147044
We skied quite a bit of the AAWT in the BHP area including pole 333 and quite a
lot of terrain that was way off most bushwalker's radar in the BHP area.
It was a bleeding amazing trip.I took up XC BC and XC DH skiing with the aim to do this very stuff and now I am living the dream.

[CraigVIC]

The FHAC business case has no public figures. Does anyone know if the Otways, Grampians and Croajingolong icon walks have available figures showing the number of walkers? Absent that, is there any anecdotal information about the number of users?

In Dec 2021 Parks posted 3000+ nights had been booked on the GPT

[Lophophaps]

In Dec 2021 Parks posted 3000+ nights had been booked on the GPT

Thanks. Do you have a link for that?

[CraigVIC]

I just saw it as a Facebook post with no breakdowns or futher detail. I imagine it was on their news/media release section at the same time. There was a block on future bookings beyond June 2022 at the time I believe.

[CraigVIC]

Looking for it in the news I see there is a more recent update, as of May, "Since opening in November 2021, hikers have booked over 7,200 nights to stay at hike-in campgrounds along the length of the trail"

https://www.parks.vic.gov.au/news/2022/ ... -july-2022

[wander]

I still see Falls Creek / Mt. Hotham getting a lease on the proposed High Knob hut and helipad and operating BC heli - skiing on Mt. FT. Of course they will have qualified BC guides etc. to cover all backsides in this risk averse nanny state but even still such a venture , were it to occur would still meet with opposition and resistance from many people.

There is no heli pick at the bottom of the Fearthtop lines, so it's a non starter really.

[Xplora]

XC DH skiing

?? Please explain.

[Baeng72]

XC DH skiing

?? Please explain.

You can't use those words without bringing a certain QLD Senator to mind.
In PCV's report he mentions: "I improved at back country XC skiing and downhill techniques." so, I'm guessing Cross Country Down Hill.
But I've been (very) wrong before....

[paidal_chalne_vala]

Cross Country Down hill skiiing rather than just bushwalking on antiquated planks.