Health issue related to my recent time in the snow

[Moondog55]

Been to see my GP
BP is OK and remarkably good for my age
Lots of bloodwork done and everything is on the better side of normal except for slightly raised cholesterol and surprisingly Uric acid.
I have a touch of gout and here was me thinking the pain in my big toes was caused by tight ski boots LOL
Having just done some relevant reading I can guess why. Exposure to cold coupled with a massive recent weight loss and a high protein diet coupled with the dehydration due to lower than water intake.
I need to slightly change my diet for a while
Anybody else ever suffered this?

[Giddy_up]

No, but I did loose quite a bit of weight over my few days wandering. 2 notches on the belt and I can only assume it was the extra my body had to do to maintain itself in a colder environment.

[GPSGuided]

No beer there.

[Giddy_up]

No beer there.

Don't drink!!!!!!!

[wayno]

animal protein is a major source of the uric acid that causes gout.....
increase your vege protein intake and decrease your mean intake... I'm not a fan of soy protein, it can cause it's own problems...

[Moondog55]

We actually don't eat a lot of animal protein ( at least not when compared to the national average ) what is a partial cause may be my loss of muscle mass because I wasn't getting in enough total calories coupled with the cold stress
Dropping from 120+ kilos to 84 in only 3 months is a rapid weight loss

[andrewa]

Rapid weight loss is a rarer cause for gout. Protein breakdown produces purines, which causes gout.

What a spectacular weight loss! You must feel so much better. Manage the gout (ie take advise of GP) and it will all equilibrate over time, and you'll be fine.

A (a GP)

[corvus]

Good natural quick fix for Gout are Fresh Cherries or Cherry Juice worked a treat for me.
corvus

[Moondog55]

Never heard of the cherry cure but I like cherries. @ Andewa I was thinking the loss of muscle mass was protein breakdown as far as my metabolism was concerned; my GP did think that was a possibility. I simply lost my appetite and stopped eating enough in the last couple of weeks and I had already gone though most of my bodies fat reserves. I did mention at the start of the season that I was a little worried that I no longer had a big "Fat Cushion" to provide extra calories at need. As for feeling better, in a few ways I do but I really miss pizza and icecream and these are pigout foods for me

[corvus]

6- 8 Cherries is what you need ("they contain anthocyanins which have anti-inflammatory properties ") other fruits you may want to test are Strawberries ,Blueberries and Grapes,fruits to limit or avoid are those with high acid content are Cranberries ,Oranges ,Pineapples and sadly Tomatoes.
And don't drink beer.
corvus

[andrewa]

84 kg sounds much healthier than 110kg.....and, think how much happier your joints will be (once they get over the gout!!).

At least you know how to sew, so that you can modify your clothing!

A

[andrewbish]

I'll bring more malt-o-milks next time!

[Swampy460]

I suffer from gout and can't really nail down what causes it apart from "cheap" red wine, but I do take (allopurinol)as preventative. And well done on the weight loss what did you do to lose it so quick ?

Swampy

[icefest]

I suffer from gout and can't really nail down what causes it apart from "cheap" red wine, but I do take (allopurinol)as preventative. And well done on the weight loss what did you do to lose it so quick ?

Swampy

He spent just under a month in the snow.

Depending on how often you get flare-ups, have you tried a food diary?

[wayno]

you have a minimum daily requirement for glucose in your body,, your brain can only use glucose for energy, it can't burn fat or its byproduct acetyl coA
your brain must have a continuous supply of glucose.
so if you have any period during a day when you dont have spare glucose to feed your brain your body will break down muscle to get enough glucose...

[Moondog55]

This is the very first time I've ever had something like this. Wayno you are right on the money, I simply wasn't eating enough to satisfy my bodies needs. Andrewa it is actually a bit more dramatic than that as before moderating my diet I was 120+ [ probably close to 130] I stopped eating home delivered pizza and Camembert /brie cheeses and started eating lots more raw vegetables and stuff. I was helping my beloved with her own weight loss program and was eating the same food as she was.
Since getting back and eating more I have gained 4 kilos and my weight seems to have stabilised at 87 kilos ( BMI=25 which is considered good, although none of the online programs have a bone density allowance built in and I am reasonably heavy framed

[icefest]

you have a minimum daily requirement for glucose in your body,, your brain can only use glucose for energy, it can't burn fat or its byproduct acetyl coA
your brain must have a continuous supply of glucose.
so if you have any period during a day when you dont have spare glucose to feed your brain your body will break down muscle to get enough glucose...

While it its true that you need to have a minimum average daily glucose intake, the statement that your brain runs only on glucose is wrong.
The brain can metabolise ketone bodies, but not for it's entire energy requirements. It takes a weeks or so for the brain to adjust but ~70% of the brains energy source can be ketone bodies.

Some parts of the brain only work with glucose, but others can use the ketone bodies acetoacetate and ß-hydroxybutyrate.



Breaking down muscle generally only occurs when the glycogen stores in the liver have been exhausted.

Last edited by icefest on Sun 24 Aug, 2014 1:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Moondog55]

Breaking down muscle generally only occurs when the glycogen stores in the liver have been exhausted.

I would have been at this point at the end of 3 or 4 weeks.
This is the first time I have totally lost my appetite, having gone through it I think I now have a slightly better understanding of those people who suffer from anorexia. My body seemed to be producing hormones that were making me sleepy and lethargic instead of hungry

[icefest]

It's possible to deplete glycogen stores in the liver within a couple of hours or exercise for days and have little effect on them; it depends on diet and exercise intensity. This is what marathon runners call "Hitting the Wall."

Moondog, your ordeal sound quite similar to a famous experiment of the 1940's. The combination of relative starvation and exercise resulted in similar effects to what you've described.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_ ... nt#Results


EDIT: Spelling

Last edited by icefest on Sun 24 Aug, 2014 3:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Moondog55]

Thanx for that link; first time I had heard of the study

[walkon]

Good natural quick fix for Gout are Fresh Cherries or Cherry Juice worked a treat for me.
corvus

I heard this on the radio and relayed it to the gout sufferers I know with lots of success. Only complaint was Cherrys aren't cheap

[andrewa]

I'm keeping out of it from now on. At the end of the day you are far better off at 80 something kg than 120 something kg, even allowing for the inconvenience of gout.

A

[walkon]

I'm keeping out of it from now on. At the end of the day you are far better off at 80 something kg than 120 something kg, even allowing for the inconvenience of gout.

A

Hey I've got a thought. The new 'biggest loser' tv program is to be run out of pretty Valley. We can have Michelle bridges vs commando vs MOONDOG.

[Tortoise]

Hey I've got a thought. The new 'biggest loser' tv program is to be run out of pretty Valley. We can have Michelle bridges vs commando vs MOONDOG.

[Moondog55]

I'm keeping out of it from now on. At the end of the day you are far better off at 80 something kg than 120 something kg, even allowing for the inconvenience of gout.

A

It's clearing up now, simply lots of water and less red meat in my diet for a short time.
I agree but the thing is I didn't "Feel" fat or overweight beforehand
Walkon I an NOT competing with the likes of Michelle Bridges

[walkon]

I'm keeping out of it from now on. At the end of the day you are far better off at 80 something kg than 120 something kg, even allowing for the inconvenience of gout.

A

It's clearing up now, simply lots of water and less red meat in my diet for a short time.
I agree but the thing is I didn't "Feel" fat or overweight beforehand
Walkon I an NOT competing with the likes of Michelle Bridges

Ok then we will write her out of the script? Talk about primedonas, what else are you demanding

[GPSGuided]

It's possible to deplete glycogen stores in the liver within a couple of hours or exercise for days and have little effect on them; it depends on diet and exercise intensity. This is what marathon runners call "Hitting the Wall."

I always understood that bonking was associated with the depletion of muscle glycogen store, at least primarily. Didn't know the end point was defined by the hepatic store. Bonked once on the bike and it was not nice. A can of coke made a difference but the effect was relatively short lived. It was a struggle to get home.

[Moondog55]

It's possible to deplete glycogen stores in the liver within a couple of hours or exercise for days and have little effect on them; it depends on diet and exercise intensity. This is what marathon runners call "Hitting the Wall."

I always understood that bonking was associated with the depletion of muscle glycogen store, at least primarily. Didn't know the end point was defined by the hepatic store. Bonked once on the bike and it was not nice. A can of coke made a difference but the effect was relatively short lived. It was a struggle to get home.

Hmm I usually associate that phraseology with something else. now I know what I have been doing wrong all this time. Although I do remember one occasion with my motorbike and a greatcoat.

Note for all other readers
I've lost so much weight that I will need to sell off or trade a lot of gear and buy some new slimmer smaller sizes to fit the new me. I'll post in the relevant section later on

[photohiker]

I guess it depends on your ability to continue bonking whether you run out of energy.

[icefest]

Did you want to wait a bit before selling moondog; just in care you regain some weight. That way you can also sell just before the next winter and maybe get better prices.