Down vest

[Moondog55]

This will be a specific purpose vest to keep in my winter daypack
my personal preference is almost always for pullovers so saving weight on the zipper and they are more comfortable generally
So a few basic questions here as it needs to layer under my MontBell Thermawrap which is bordering small on me
Hood or no hood?
Differential cut on a sewn thru?
60 grams or 90 or 120 ?
My thinking is to make it crutch length with a gather strap to stop it riding up [ sitting bivvies really do need this and it was the primary mod to my big MD Everest parka] but unsure of the need for a hood, there is plenty of room for a hood tho as the Thermawrap hood is oversized.
I don't have to buy fabric as I have some nylon taffeta here and for something this small I don't thin their will be too great a weight and bulk penalty to use 2 ounce fabric [ yes is is old enough to be in Imperial measurements] it's the same windproof fabric I used to line the big overbag with. I have a few metres[ yards if we are using Imperial LOL] left

[stry]

Don't like hoods. With temp down to -5 to maybe -8 (limit of my experience, I prefer a good collar plus whatever goes on my head. If it's much cooler the hood would be more attractive to me.

I have a WM Flight vest size M which is specced at 70 grams of down. Given that you want length and perhaps a crutch strap, and are several sizes bigger than M, I would think that 90grams would be a bare minimum, and that 120 would be a better goal.

Differential cut would be a nice touch as you are DIYing. BUT - I have a few stitched through down garments, which don't appear to be differential cut, and I have never felt that differential cut would be an improvement for any of them. The heaviest is a WM Meltdown with 185 grams fill (I don't usually use the built in hood, although I have tried it) Very warm!!!

If the design and use was more aimed at seriously evil alpine weather, baffles and diff cut are likely to have something to offer.

[Moondog55]

Thanx Stry. It will be hooded or collarless, if I sew in a hood I can think about leaving the heavy Patagonia balaclava out or alternatively the Damart Finnish cowl

[stry]

Thanx Stry. It will be hooded or collarless, if I sew in a hood I can think about leaving the heavy Patagonia balaclava out or alternatively the Damart Finnish cowl

If that's the choice, I'd opt for the hood. Lot of heat to be lost around the neck and the top little bit of the torso. My Egge vest had no collar, but my current stuff has mandarin collars, which are nice and cosy, and when combined with good head wear, leave very little exposed.

[Moondog55]

I'd love a good quality picture of the Egge vest Stry

[stry]

Well, I'll see if I can find it (I had two). I think it is with a family member.

[andrewa]

Differentially cut box wall down clothing is hard work to design and make. Not only does the inner need to be smaller than the outer, but the seams where the holes are need to be the same length - collar, lower hem, and arms - so the inner fabric has to taper out to join the outer fabric. Back in the mid 80s I made 2 box wall differentially cut down jkts with goretex "seamless" (ie minimal seams) outers.....the most frustrating bit was finding out that the straight baffle material I used on the arms collapsed when wrapped around an arm, and the baffles really need to be cut from circles of material...!

My current very cozy RAB neutrino is sewn through. Unless you're heading for the arctic etc, I'd keep the design simple, esp for a vest, where heat loss from arms would far outweigh heat loss from sewn through construction.

And, as for a hood. I'd just have one on my jacket ( but I also have a really great down beanie for when it gets colder).

A

[Moondog55]

I've got the differential cut tables in my book by Gerry
Actually I think it's the other way around the outer is cut bigger than the inner as clothing size is measured to the chest size, i:e the inner cut. But I take the point I'm just being a little pedantic as I think these distinctions are important
What I was asking was if using a differential cut was useful in a sewn thru garment. I've not ever seen mention of it, One thing I did pick up on tho was the need even, in a sewn thru vest, of a short baffle on the shoulder seam. That is courtesy of an old REI down vest I owned in the 70's.
I can actually see in my mind that having the outer cut larger than the inner would allow for a better fit to the inside of the Thermawrap that would be worn over the top of this

If I go somewhere really cold I have an appropriate parka [ several actually] and I do believe the sleeve baffles on that is cut in circles.

[Moondog55]

Well Simon has down back in stock so I better order my 100 grams but I may as well do this properly and buy some ULW fabric too
As I can't find any of the vest patterns I know are around will a meter of Argon be enough for an XL vest with hood?

[stry]

Depends on the width a bit doesn't it ??

I'm the sort who always buys a bit extra, but have known highly skilled DIYers who always buy a bit less and have never been beaten.

[neilmny]

Well Simon has down back in stock so I better order my 100 grams but I may as well do this properly and buy some ULW fabric too
As I can't find any of the vest patterns I know are around will a meter of Argon be enough for an XL vest with hood?

Looking forward to the story and pictures MD.

[simonm]

Well Simon has down back in stock so I better order my 100 grams but I may as well do this properly and buy some ULW fabric too
As I can't find any of the vest patterns I know are around will a meter of Argon be enough for an XL vest with hood?

I think 1 metre should just about it do it the width of the roll is 150cm and the length will be a little over 1 metre. Sounds like it should be enough????

[stry]

If I recall correctly, MD is at least 1000mm around the chest.

This vest wil probably be around 750/800 long.

Two layers are needed, and the quilting will effectively shorten everything a bit. Plus hood.

A bit doubtful about 1500 x 1000 reliably doing that, even with fancy cutting and odd shaped bits here and there.

Strongly suggest mocking up a pattern before deciding MD.

[Moondog55]

Spot on
I was going to use the other stuff but seeing as how I am going to make my own I thought I'd try sewing the Argon
47 inches around so allowing for other clothes underneath [ even if just LW fleece] that's 50
50*25.4 =1270 so that's the width.
Cut the outer part of the shell wider by enough to allow full loft + 10% Width times 2 for each side of the shell by the drop so 2meters minimum
Sometimes it helps to hear yourself talk out loud

[simonm]

Ha ha yes sorry I was forgetting it had 2 sides, not sure what i thought was going to hold the down in If only you knew the day I had

[Moondog55]

Well Simon I was sitting on an "Almost 3" all day who ran me ragged so I can guess.
Order in a few days when I get my government pittance

[simonm]

Well Simon I was sitting on an "Almost 3" all day who ran me ragged so I can guess.
Order in a few days when I get my government pittance

Yes running a home business and looking after young kids, certainly has it's challenges, on a good day.

[neilmny]

Ah....it's wonderful being grandparent. Just when things are getting a bit frazzled, Mum and Dad take them home.
Keep up the good work Simon.

[Moondog55]

For those who have used it query
Argon 90 or the Argon 67?
Difference is only going to be a few dollars, although for an inner vest I know I'll be better off with the 750 lofting down

[simonm]

Argon 90 is thicker (obviously), has more DWR on it, and will be a bit more abrasion resistant. Argon 67 has a softer feel, weighs less, and will be slightly more compact.

The other option is Argon 90 outer and 67 inner.

[Moondog55]

Argon 67 it is