How long to decompose

[Lophophaps]

I have long held that coloured toilet paper takes longer to decompose, and hence take white. Whilst there are a number of websites on this general topic, I cannot find a clear reference to coloured. Does anyone have definitive advice on this? TIA.
http://hikethru.com/hiking-information/ ... omposition
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin ... ad_id=7247
https://lnt.org/learn/principle-3
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15572078

[GPSGuided]

Products from different manufacturers are different. Do your own test in the garden.

[Moondog55]

While not exactly a pleasant subject there has long been an argument for taking along a poo-tube and packing used paper out with you or having a sanitation burn in the camp fire if you use one.
I have seen toilet paper last from one ski season to the next; bleached paper takes quite a while to break down

[north-north-west]

While not exactly a pleasant subject there has long been an argument for taking along a poo-tube and packing used paper out with you or having a sanitation burn in the camp fire if you use one.

Hasn't someone in the states just been done for causing a bushfire by doing that?

[Lophophaps]

Yes, see
http://abcnews.go.com/Weird/wireStory/b ... r-32651015
There are other links
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/01/2 ... 38001.html
http://mtstandard.com/news/local/update ... 963f4.html
It's enough to give you the ...

[Moondog55]

While not exactly a pleasant subject there has long been an argument for taking along a poo-tube and packing used paper out with you or having a sanitation burn in the camp fire if you use one.

Hasn't someone in the states just been done for causing a bushfire by doing that?

Dunno but you only light a camp fire is it's safe to do so
They may have done something really stupid like burning toilet paper in a hole in the duff.

[michael_p]

Do your own test in the garden.

LOL. I'd like to be there when you explain this to the boys in blue.

[GPSGuided]

LOL. I'd like to be there when you explain this to the boys in blue.

How so? For burying a few different types of toilet paper in the garden?

[Tortoise]

While not exactly a pleasant subject there has long been an argument for taking along a poo-tube and packing used paper out with you or having a sanitation burn in the camp fire if you use one.
I have seen toilet paper last from one ski season to the next; bleached paper takes quite a while to break down

While I've only done the DIY poo-tube thing a couple of times, I've got into the habit of packing out my used paper in the absence of loos - off-topic perhaps, but it does address the problem of any paper being left behind. I double-bag it, zip-locked for safety. Stir a little soil into the poo to speed up decomposition. Not difficult unless it's a long walk - then I might limit how much paper I carry out.

Warning - don't forget to fully empty your pack upon arriving home.

[missingdna]

yeah... if i dig and burn i dont think ive ever dumped that big, or used THAT much paper that if i burn in situ, its a bush fire risk... those guys in the usa probably used a hike-lite flame thrower meant for roasting snags to burn their bog rolls

[north-north-west]

yeah... if i dig and burn i dont think ive ever dumped that big, or used THAT much paper that if i burn in situ, its a bush fire risk... those guys in the usa probably used a hike-lite flame thrower meant for roasting snags to burn their bog rolls

No, just picked a bad time in the wrong place.

[Moondog55]

Duff burns exceedingly easily and it's very common to have duff floors in US forests and fires can burn undetected for weeks before the break out somewhere, just like some Tasmanian turfs

[aloftas]

Duff burns exceedingly easily and it's very common to have duff floors in US forests and fires can burn undetected for weeks before the break out somewhere, just like some Tasmanian turfs

by duff you mean peat?

It can burn for weeks.

[north-north-west]

I think he just means compacted pine needles. I think...

[aloftas]

I think he just means compacted pine needles. I think...

copy that, cheers

[Moondog55]

Duff

http://www.firewords.net/definitions/duff_layer.htm

[north-north-west]

Y'know, when I first saw this thread title I thought it was going to be a Hamletian meditation on the transience of life - "How long must a man lie i' the earth ere he rot" sort of thing.
And now it's kind of got me wondering how long your average body would survive in the bush before becoming nothing but scattered bones. Would be highly variable depending on location and season, of course, but still.

Is this a normal line of thought or am I going through one of my crazier phases?

[Moondog55]

Not an unreasonable question.
The warmer it is the quicker you rot and it can take only a little time for the flesh to decompose and get scavenged. In summer a kangaroo carcase can be reduced to skin and bone is a few weeks but the bones can last a long long time as scattered remnants and obviously the bigger denser bones last the longest.
It's a bodyfarm experiment that goes on all the time
At a guess tho the modern clothing we tend to wear would outlast most of the body parts except the long leg bones and the skull.
3 to 5 years? About the same as bleached toilet paper
Any forensic pathologists on the forum?

[MickyB]

Assuming a Tassie devil doesn't eat you first.

[MickyB]

And now it's kind of got me wondering how long your average body would survive in the bush before becoming nothing but scattered bones.

Do your own test in the garden.

[north-north-west]

And now it's kind of got me wondering how long your average body would survive in the bush before becoming nothing but scattered bones.

Do your own test in the garden.

I need a body to work with. Any volunteers?

[GPSGuided]

LOL! How did a discussion the decomposition rates b/n toilet papers with and without floral print on it got turned into morbid discussion on human postmortem decomposition?

For human decomposition rate, that's pretty well documented for various environmental conditions. It's what forensic pathologists do.
http://science.howstuffworks.com/body-farm1.htm

Going back to toilet paper, we know little of the characteristics of the current range of products in our supermarkets. Who is going to do it?

[Moondog55]

Well as a gardener who sheet mulches with the easily composted newsprint I can tell you that even with ideal conditions and an acid soil with adequate nitrogen levels that medium can last up to 3 years but I have some bleached cardboard that is still breaking down after 7 years that toilet paper can last at least that long
Main determinate is water, damp paper breaks down quickly and we all know how dry the bush can be.
Thanx for the body farm link The road kill I put in the compost does break down quicker than the paper I add at the same time
I hot compost and some things disappear very quickly, cellulose and lignin are very resistant to breakdown, it's why good soil takes years to make

[GPSGuided]

The question on floral printed vs plain toilet paper remain unanswered.

[Moondog55]

Printed will take longer as it's always on bleached substock and most inks are more resistant than the base structure, even soy based printing inks are visible on the paper in my compost for a long time. Often the only way i can tell it was originally newsprint in me hands is I can still see print

[GPSGuided]

It's not quite right to compare to newsprints as they are from a different paper stock. As for toilet paper, I suspect there's little difference in the treatment of the paper stock. Adding the print would have been a very superficial (cheap) process. Of course, there is a variety of toilet papers by brand out there and that will likely have greater differences.

[Lophophaps]

I'm not sure that a garden test on bodies is desirable. Not in a national park either, you know, carry in and carry out. My understanding is that the various PWS encourage bushwalkers and other back country users to remove their own dead. Some have a user-pays service that does this.

Bring out dead.jpg (7.33 KiB) Viewed 20573 times

[icefest]

Duff

http://www.firewords.net/definitions/duff_layer.htm

Thank you. Much better than http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=duff

My first thought on the matter was:

Code:

What do you hear at Beethoven"s grave if you are really quiet?
The 9th symphony played backwards.

I personally quite like burning my TP (as long as i'm not in a total fire ban area; and it isn't a high risk area)

If an animal does unbury my poo (which I'm hoping doesn't occurr) it will not look like human poop.

[vicrev]

Zombie films would be a big hit with some on this forum .....

[MickyB]

Zombie films would be a big hit with some on this forum .....

The Bush Walking Dead