Garmin Rino 650 radio issue.

[Benny_Boy83]

Hi Folks,

I bought a Garmin Rino in august 2016. The GOS has worked pretty well so far. It was in February/arch this year that i started to get into more group and adventurous hikes, many with a youth group, where radios are essential for communication. Naturally i thought i was set as the Rino has one built in. I since discovered that the ring does not work on repeater channels. But the biggest issue seems to be the range. We tested all the radios before our hike (a mixture of GME and Uniden with mine being the only Garmin) and it all seemed good. However out on the track my off siders GME 2w radio was picking up transmission that my Garmin on 5w power was missing. So i know line of sight isn't the issue. I've been trying to trouble shoot the problem for a few weeks now, and Garmin just sent me an email message yesterday with this reply.


"Thank you for your email.

The Rino 650 is designed to work and communicate with another Rino 650. If you are trying with a third party radio then the results may be inconsistent/intermittent. In order to determine whether there is a fault with the unit, it would need to be tested with another Rino 650."


To me this message is utter rubbish as It is printed on the box, "And because Rino is a 5 watt UHF radio, you can use it to communicate with any other UHF radio around."

AS far as I'm aware Garmin does not own any specific frequencies, nor would it make sense to them to run their own propriety radio fequencies so I'm not sure what they expect to achieve with their own system, when they advertise that the radio can work with any other radio.

Any assistance it trouble shooting or dealing with Garmin would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

[Strider]

From memory the Rino is not a UHF but transmits on the FRS/GMRS bands which are only supported in the US?

*EDIT*

Garmin website confirms this is the case
https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/82798#specs

[Benny_Boy83]

Cheers strider.

The american/canadian model doesn't run the UHF frequencies, but the Australian model does. I heard stories about rinos bought overseas that didn't work in aus for that reason.

http://www.chsmith.com.au/Products/Garm ... Radio.html

I bought min from Johnny appleseed but the specs in the above link should be the same.

what tipped me over the edge in purchasing the GPS was the promise on the package that the radio will work with all UHF radios. (attached image) Currently my Garmin radio won't do that.

cheers.

[tastrax]

It could also be the quality of the antenna squished into the garmin.

[Strider]

Is there any way to adjust the squelch? It sounds like it may be set too high if your other radio nearby is receiving OK.

[tastrax]

Should be able to adjust squelch

http://static.garmin.com/pumac/Rino_Aus_OM_EN.pdf

[keithy]

That response from Garmin is pretty crap but not unusual.

Check the CTCSS and the DCS settings. These are the squelch settings and can block out other brands if not using the same frequencies and codes.

Check the transmission power under radio setup. From memory you could have it at 0.5W / 1W / 2W / 5W. The default might be 0.5W. Also I think you could only achieve the 5W setting is you used the lithium ion battery pack. If you used the AA battery pack, I think the max you could select was 2W.

Check your firmware. Have you updated to the latest? The latest is v4.80. The version should be under System About. Some of the firmware updates had meant to fix some radio transmission issues.

I helped someone with their Rino a few years back but mainly on the GPS part. I remember that we had issues with the radio part when paired with the Motorola and Unidens we were using. When I looked back then, I recall some people with issues with the radio portion of the Rinos but I cannot recall the forums they were on anymore.

[Benny_Boy83]

That response from Garmin is pretty crap but not unusual.

Check the CTCSS and the DCS settings. These are the squelch settings and can block out other brands if not using the same frequencies and codes.

Check the transmission power under radio setup. From memory you could have it at 0.5W / 1W / 2W / 5W. The default might be 0.5W. Also I think you could only achieve the 5W setting is you used the lithium ion battery pack. If you used the AA battery pack, I think the max you could select was 2W.

Check your firmware. Have you updated to the latest? The latest is v4.80. The version should be under System About. Some of the firmware updates had meant to fix some radio transmission issues.

I helped someone with their Rino a few years back but mainly on the GPS part. I remember that we had issues with the radio part when paired with the Motorola and Unidens we were using. When I looked back then, I recall some people with issues with the radio portion of the Rinos but I cannot recall the forums they were on anymore.

Cheers Keith. I've tried tried everything you've suggested prior to the latest email from Garmin. I have to compliment Johnny Appleseed for helping with the firmware updates, even though i could do that at home. It also through johnny appleseed that i learn that the communication issue i have is down in their system as a known issue. So it would appear as if I'm just getting a run around from Garmin trying to deny the issue exists.
I've not had to use the AA battery pack yet. with the right power setting, i've managed to make the 650 last over two - three days on the lithium pack.

Is there any way to adjust the squelch? It sounds like it may be set too high if your other radio nearby is receiving OK.

I've tried that too. This seemed to fix an initial problem when we were testing in a room before an expedition.

I suspect Garmin thinks, since the 650 are no longer in production, that I'm out to replace my unit which is still under warranty with the newer 750. The radio issues have put me off Garmin radios big time. If it came down to a replacement i'd go for a GPS only device and a seperate radio.

[keithy]

I have to compliment Johnny Appleseed for helping with the firmware updates, even though i could do that at home. It also through johnny appleseed that i learn that the communication issue i have is down in their system as a known issue. So it would appear as if I'm just getting a run around from Garmin trying to deny the issue exists.

I've also found Johnny Appleseed are pretty good. I did try to look on my old PC to find the links to the GPS forums that I recalled others having issues with the Rino radio functions. I am pretty sure it was an Aus GPS forum,or a 4x4 forum, but couldn't find it. People were having similar issues to yours.

The radio issues have put me off Garmin radios big time. If it came down to a replacement i'd go for a GPS only device and a seperate radio.

That's what my mate ended up doing. I convinced him to get an Oregon 650 for the GPS, and a separate UHF CB walkie. I think he ended up selling his Rino.

The one advantage I thought the Rino had that was pretty cool was the ability to send your location to another Rino unit. But I think having a reliable UHF radio would be preferable.

[GPSGuided]

Keeping the radio and GPS functions in separate units make good sense.

[Benny_Boy83]

I should add, that the section of email in my first post was, at the time, the latest in a series of emails.

I had a reply from Garmin yesterday. Im not sure if they read these forums and saw this thread, or if they realised their latest excuse/reason was a contradiction to the product description. They have finally requested that i send the unit for a diagnostic. Although it will be against another Garmin 650. So I'm not sure what that will prove, but at least it feels like Im making progress again.

[GPSGuided]

Keep us posted on the outcome.

[Benny_Boy83]

Garmin has just got back to me. They sent a video of the radio working. So they could not replicate the fault. They tested it with a Garmin 750 and a another UHF brand. It seemed to work. So what ever the issue is, it's intermittent.
They are sending the unit back.
Unfortunately I can no longer place any faith in Garmin Radios So ill Keep the Rhino 650 as a GPS only and buy a seperate radio.
My life and the lives of my group are not worth intermittent gear faults.

[Strider]

Thats frustrating to hear Benny but important to note that no UHF should ever be relied upon for emergency communications. Spend your money on a PLB instead if safety is your aim.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[GPSGuided]

Agree. UHF radios are line of sight communication modality and don't work well in hilly country to the point of being useless.

[Benny_Boy83]

PLB is certainly on the list, (Yay tax return) more than likely will be getting a spot tracker. Radio was more for intergroup communication. Sucks when your supposed to lead a group but can't because you have the only radio in the group that doesn't talk to the rest. Oh well, expensive lesson learnt.

[Strider]

A Spot isn't a substitute for a PLB - two quite different purposes. Do lots of research before handing over the cash [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[Benny_Boy83]

Oh yes, I'm aware of the differences. One of the volunteer organisation I'm associated with loves the "we're OK" button that lets them see where you are without the need to call for help. Plus it also has the call for help button as well as the critical emergency button. I think, it would give my family some relief to know where i am at times.

[GBW]

A Spot isn't a substitute for a PLB - two quite different purposes. Do lots of research before handing over the cash [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]

Spot has an emergency rescue button. Push it and see what happens.

[Strider]

A Spot isn't a substitute for a PLB - two quite different purposes. Do lots of research before handing over the cash [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]

Spot has an emergency rescue button. Push it and see what happens.

Spots transmit at a much lower output (from memory 400mW vs 5W for a PLB) and are monitored by a private third party corporation based in the US. If I'm about to die I want to be damn sure that the button actually works.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[Benny_Boy83]

For the record, I got the radio back a week and a half ago. I brought it to the Boonah Freedom challenge and tested it with the other radios on site (ch32) Garmin radio just doesn't play nice with others. Now looking at a GME TX6150/TX6155 or similar.