I just had the worst night of my life!

[Moondog55]

Wayno isn't that half the point of the post. OP forgot to put a bit of string in his pocket/removed extra guys and forgot to put them back?
Rocks do work very well if you can pick them up and move them into the right place but cold wet and tired you forget stuff and make mistakes

[wayno]

its common in nz to use rocks by default and pegs as a last resort.

[north-north-west]

get some rocks, tie your guy line around a rock and put another rock on hte guy line between between the first rock and the tent, heavy enough to not move in the wind... you can to the same with a stick and a rock...

It's not always easy to find loose rocks. Otherwise that works a treat.

[peregrinator]

Wayno isn't that half the point of the post. OP forgot to put a bit of string in his pocket/removed extra guys and forgot to put them back?
Rocks do work very well if you can pick them up and move them into the right place but cold wet and tired you forget stuff and make mistakes

And at the time rocks might have helped, it was snowing. What rocks?

[Chezza]

I suspect the OP knows what he's doing, and doesn't need advice. He got complacent or pushed the limits of going light. He knows what he did wrong, the post was a cautionary tale for the community.

I bet he'll be pitching tents with great care for some time to come

[north-north-west]

I suspect the OP knows what he's doing, and doesn't need advice. He got complacent or pushed the limits of going light. He knows what he did wrong, the post was a cautionary tale for the community.

I bet he'll be pitching tents with great care for some time to come

Spot on. We all have something to learn from this little tale.

[icefest]

get some rocks, tie your guy line around a rock and put another rock on hte guy line between between the first rock and the tent, heavy enough to not move in the wind... you can to the same with a stick and a rock...

Just don't roll the big rock around or drag it - that'll chew through the guy line and you have a big problem.

[Moondog55]

I suspect the OP knows what he's doing, and doesn't need advice. He got complacent or pushed the limits of going light. He knows what he did wrong, the post was a cautionary tale for the community.

Of course; that's why I told my tale of getting lost last winter, a teaching lesson to share

[jeremy089786]

Just some clarifications on this one. I didn't remove any extra guys (and I did have extra rope in my pocket), and didn't skimp on pegs just for weight, I just remember reading somewhere on BPL or some blog that these mids pitch better with just the 4 attachment points. This has always served me well in relatively high winds in the snow, but during these times I have been using snow anchors which hold considerably better. I really thought I had packed the four 9 inch stakes, such that when I pulled the 4.5 inch one out I was startled. Now thinking logically about it, having more pegs can never hurt!

I also should have piled the pegs up with rocks, which I have done in the past, but for some reason, this time I just thought it would be OK. The wind had died down and most of the rocks around there were very firmly attached to the ground and the views were excellent so I got lazy. In hindsight I feel pretty silly for not taking every precautionary measure but after so many trips where mild or normally bad conditions have been comfortably weathered out I got complacent and didn't give this place the respect it deserved. Something I won't be doing again!

[wayno]

no worries, thanks for sharing, we all need reminding from time to time the dangers of getting complacent. your trip has served a useful purpose after all..

[stry]

get some rocks, tie your guy line around a rock and put another rock on hte guy line between between the first rock and the tent, heavy enough to not move in the wind... you can to the same with a stick and a rock...

Just don't roll the big rock around or drag it - that'll chew through the guy line and you have a big problem.

Good point Icefest. In the situations when the rocks on pegs are necessary, nothing will stop the tent and guys moving, and that movement, if it goes on for long enough, will cause rocks to chew through guy lines that are abraded on the rocks.

You don't have to roll or drag anything - just give it a little time and the wind will do its thing !!

[nq111]

Great post jeremy089786, especially for being brave and putting up the warts and all account for everyone to learn from.

Having been through similar conditions in sound tents (and being scared), I shudder to imagine what it must have been like with everything going screwy through the night.

As for tips, I came to the same conclusion that you posited - if in the high country with a chance of being caught out exposed be sure to carry a bombshelter tent. You'll never regret the weight after experiencing just one night out like you went through. Plus, with a very secure tent to retreat to you can push the boundaries further with weight savings in all the other gear. For example you probably don't need a heavy synthetic sleeping bag, bivy bag and heavy fleeces if you are confident in your tent.

[north-north-west]

As for tips, I came to the same conclusion that you posited - if in the high country with a chance of being caught out exposed be sure to carry a bombshelter tent. ...

This has always been my main rationale for carrying the Nallo on most of my trips. And after finding out the limitations of a lighter and smaller tent during the Eldons traverse, I'm wishing I'd stuck to that. Although how I'd have managed the extra weight . . . ?

[wayno]

i'm reading "Into Thin Air"
you got off lightly....

[Chezza]

I hope no one is suggesting a "bombproof" Hilleberg would survive that night with no guylines deployed, 25% of the pegs used being 4.5" long and no rocks on the pegs.

[north-north-west]

Nope, but I always guy out the Nallo, even if it's a calm night in a really sheltered spot.

[nq111]

I hope no one is suggesting a "bombproof" Hilleberg would survive that night with no guylines deployed, 25% of the pegs used being 4.5" long and no rocks on the pegs.

Nope. The bombproof tent mentality definitely extends to the pegs. I always carry some snow pegs and extra guylines in the high country as well as a variety of other pegs that can be used in combination or with natural features as deadmans if things get rough.

I see your point though, the pyramid may have survived just fine with good pegs and guy-outs.

Whatever the case, you got to have confidence in the shelter setup to go light with everything else.

[Nuts]

I also should have piled the pegs up with rocks, which I have done in the past, but for some reason, this time I just thought it would be OK. The wind had died down and most of the rocks around there were very firmly attached to the ground and the views were excellent so I got lazy. In hindsight I feel pretty silly for not taking every precautionary measure but after so many trips where mild or normally bad conditions have been comfortably weathered out I got complacent and didn't give this place the respect it deserved. Something I won't be doing again!

I'm sure we've all done this, Re-learned some things through bitter experience
Well done, interesting tale, stay safe~!

[Lophophaps]

The OP advised "This led to wind and rain blowing through the top vent of the tent and then coming down through the mesh onto my sleeping bag." How many tents have top vents, how many have mesh, and how many have provision for closing the vent, most probably with velcro? A top vent is good for reducing condensation, but not if it acts as a scoop for precipitation. Is there a case for having no vent, being more waterproof and offering a better wind profile? I've never had weather so wild such that moisture comes in through the vent. All my tents with vents have velcro closures.

[wayno]

depends what conditions the mid was designed for, possibly not as severe as that, those were conditions more suited to an alpine or winter tent... qet quite a few people in nz who break tent poles in the wind in NZ when a storm blows through outside of winter, stronger than people expect

[Chezza]

It was a Duomid. From the MLD Duomid page:

"Peak Vent - Very Large vent is held open by a flexible and removable wand. Can be fully closed to stop any blown snow from entering- Just pull out the wand and press the velcro together- about 5 seconds."

I can verify that my Duomid is as described. The OP may have an older version though.

[JohnStrider]

Thanks for the post, Jeremy. I love reading about people's trips that have been successful. But trips such as yours are equally, if not more, important to read. Yes you got into a bit of trouble, but your story serves as an example of what not to do, but also what to do if you get into a similar situation.

Thanks again.

[jeremy089786]

Hi Guys,
I’m glad some found the write up useful! Also, hot tip about the vent, I knew there must be some way to close it, I couldn’t manage it whilst fumbling around in the cold and wet, but will have a good play in my room!
Cheers,
J.

[Lophophaps]

Hi Guys,
I’m glad some found the write up useful! Also, hot tip about the vent, I knew there must be some way to close it, I couldn’t manage it whilst fumbling around in the cold and wet, but will have a good play in my room!

Fair enough. It was a dark and stormy night, and you did the best you and perhaps anyone could have done under the circumstances. Vents should be able to be quickly, easily and securely closed, at night and with no torch. I've closed vents, but never in such a challenging environment. Writing about your epic is good as it crystallises what went wrong and right, and what should be done next time. This thread and others like it will add to our knowledge, a small brick in the safety wall.

[farefam]

From personal experience I would advise against placing rocks on your tent pegs in high winds. High winds impacting your tent can pull the peg guys about, lifting even heavy rocks up and down or side to side, eventually abrading the elastic or fabric peg guys causing them to finally snap. In a severe storm a while back it was only the pegs that had rocks on them that ended up with the guys snapped. The others survived the storm unscathed. Better to use extra or longer or better placed pegs instead. Saves on tent repairs too! Or better still, try to find a better sheltered site (not always possible I'll admit).

[Franco]

Extreme situations, extreme remedies...
It may not have worked that night but one can minimise or eliminate possible abrasion from rocks by sacrificing a stuff sack or some other material (spare sock...) to place between the tie outs and the rocks.
Of course the heavier and smoother the rocks the easier it will be.
Grass may work too...
( I have used Chux...)

[longlux]

I always carry a couple of large heavy duty bin bags, you can always slip the sleeping bag & yourself into them.

[TerryMcC]

Great trip report. I was only in the Mount Tate area the week before, and the weather was nothing like that! Main Range weather can be fickle. Glad you got out in good order.

[TerryMcC]

've thought about this trip several times over the last couple of days and I guess there are some lessons in this. I've walked the Rolling Ground area, CSP and through to Twynam numerous times and know the area well. Weather along the main range is unpredictable at times, and when it does turn on you, it certainly can be nasty. Further, getting reliable weather reports from the Main Range is difficult if you don't have mobile reception, and Telstra is the carrier which provides the best coverage. So I guess one thing that continues to puzzle me is why there is not investment in providing weather reports, via eg FM community radio on perhaps a sched-basis, same every hour on the hour. I carry a small iPod nano to allow me to listen to podcasts at night, and it has the benefit of also having an FM radio. On a multi-day walk in the alpine country, if I could access regular weather forecasts and reports, it would certainly make for a safer trip. Without this, of course, then one has to rely on being able to read the weather and decide early when it is time to bunker down. Welcome any thoughts in this...I've spent too many days and nights weathering out a storm on the Main Range.

[DarrenM]

The usual BOM forecast is reasonably accurate on the whole and over the years, I've managed to trust it to an extent. If you watch the local alpine weather forecast long enough and back it up with time on the Main Range, you'll soon figure out the regular inaccuracies or conservative estimates on things like snowfall/rainfall amounts etc.

In fact its fair to say that even some of the less accurate forecasting sites can be used to some degree once you understand the inaccuracies and see the trend over a longer period. From Schlink Pass through to Thredbo you will get a least some reception most of the way up high and I quite often get rolling internet access to reach the latest alpine forecast.

Most people only really need a 4 day forecast before they get reception again. For those out longer, study the charts and maybe geek out on the weather forums on ski.com.au to really learn about the patterns for longer term predictions.

I watch the barometer during winter trips longer than a week where my forecast runs out but that is definitely an art in itself due to so many other factors.

I've never carried an FM radio onto the Main Range TerryMcC, but am interested to hear how good the reception is up in the Northern end of the park. Some of the wether/snow reports from local Jindy radio can be quite Sh$t and hardly specific to backcountry travel. I agree it would be a handy tool if there were at least twice daily alpine forecasts that could be received in the middle of nowhere.