Accident at the Hanging Rock - Blue Mtns

[tom_brennan]

It is all a bit of a moot point as it's not actually legal under the plan of management for BMNP (unless they got prior approval ), but the discussion is interesting.

The impression I get is that people who are already involved in activities like climbing, canyoning and abseiling think rope swings are less dangerous than people who aren't.

From the Plan of Management

* Abseiling, rock climbing, canyoning and river activities are approved in the park provided that activities are undertaken in accordance with:
- the provisions of this plan, including approved sites, closures and group size;
- any code of conduct promoted by the Service;
- any other restrictions, exclusions or closures which may from time to time be introduced by the Service.
* Persons who wish to undertake any other activities in the park which may involve risking the safety of the person or the safety of other persons will require prior approval from the Regional Manager under the National Parks and Wildlife (Land Management) Regulation 1995.
* Bungy jumping, base jumping and hang-gliding will not be permitted. Parachuting may only be permitted subject to strict conditions for the protection of public safety, the park environment and scenic values.

[GPSGuided]

Thanks Tom for the fact input. Now, only if these participants would just climb back up the Hanging Rock, then their activity would be covered under rock climbing and abseiling...

The impression I get is that people who are already involved in activities like climbing, canyoning and abseiling think rope swings are less dangerous than people who aren't.

"Less" dangerous to what? That is the question.

[puredingo]

As for many of these reports, the information may not be entirely accurate.

I think you can take that as a given for most newspaper reports! I've never found one that was correct when I knew all the facts.

Well if I was writing this article for the paper it would of been titled "No picnic at hanging rock!"....

[GPSGuided]

Another sad one.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/man-dies-in-b ... jhyum.html

[wallwombat]

R.I.P Toby

One of the nicest guys you could meet.

[JD The Bushwalker]

Another sad one.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/man-dies-in-b ... jhyum.html

Attached to the link is a further link of this video, which displays what I believe to have what has occurred.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbQ0hH3KN_c&feature=youtu.be

[north-north-west]

What gets me is they don't even bother with helmets.

[GPSGuided]

Understand it this way. If they are safety conscious they wouldn't be doing this. Further, the helmet is not going to help with the type and severity of injuries they are likely to sustain, as exemplified in this case - Pelvic fracture and shock from internal bleeding.

[Grabeach]

Not into the rope sports, but I do know a bit of physics, so I'll add a few comments from that perspective.

Without pre-empting any official investigations, the set-up at Hanging Rock has one obvious danger, that being the ledge below the take-off point. Note that this complication does not exist when launching from a bridge or a platform constructed out from a cliff edge.

To avoid hitting this ledge there must be sufficient horizontal displacement of the swinger away from the cliff in the time it takes to ‘fall’ the vertical distance to the ledge. The horizontal component has to come from either or a combination of;
1. Horizontal velocity when jumping from the cliff.
2. A tension force in the rope (ie. having the elastic rope ‘stretched’ prior to the swinger clipping on). Note that if the take-off point is above the pivot point, the rope will also slacken as the swinger drops due to the distance from the pivot point to the swinger decreasing until they are level, hence additional pre-tensioning will be required.

Has anyone ever calculated all (any?) of these factors at Hanging Rock? Do the people out there REALLY know what they’re doing? Or is it just luck a few more people haven't been killed?

[north-north-west]

Has anyone ever calculated all (any?) of these factors at Hanging Rock? Do the people out there REALLY know what they’re doing? Or is it just luck a few more people haven't been killed?

My vote goes to option 3.

[Lophophaps]

Has anyone ever calculated all (any?) of these factors at Hanging Rock? Do the people out there REALLY know what they’re doing? Or is it just luck a few more people haven't been killed?

My vote goes to option 3.

Doubtless these and other questions will be answered in due course. Essentially the risk was taken by mostly young mostly male people who believe that their setup is safe. They have three ropes where one rope is strong enough to take a leader fall when rock climbing. Perhaps the other two ropes are to mitigate abrasion. On one picture there was a piece of fabric over the edge for this reason. They think they know what they are doing.

The mindset is important. Young males tend to diminish the chance of an adverse event. Computer games and entertainment show people getting hurt and recovering. Easy. As these young people grow up they may realise the fraility of the human body.

Vehicular crashes used to be called accidents. This word now applies to crashes caused by unforseeable more unavoidable things such as an an otherwise roadworthy vehicle that has an engine suddenly stopping or a steering locking; a small rock flying up and hitting the windscreen; a child running onto the road; or a healthy driver having a heart attack or petite mal. A collision can be caused by being under the influence of drugs or acolhol; failing to give way; failing to indicate; going faster than the posted limit or than is advised having due regard for the prevailing circumstances. These are all avoidable and are hence not accidents.

It thus seems to me that any injury or fatality that happens at the Hanging Rock by people who swing on ropes is not an accident. It's avoidable.